Transportation Exchange presented by Rush Truck Centres of Canada

Tips for spec'ing Heavy Haul Tractors, Dump Trucks and Roll Offs

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Join Adam Bajric, Account Manager at Rush Truck Centres of Canada, as he unveils the intricacies of spec'ing heavy haul tractors, dump trucks, and roll-offs for your operations. From engines to transmissions, suspensions to frames, and interior trim choices, Adam shares his wealth of expertise and essential tips to ensure optimal performance. Tune in to discover the recommended options to keep in mind that can elevate your fleet's efficiency and productivity.


Jason Cuddy:

Hello and welcome to another episode of the Transportation Exchange podcast presented by Rush Truck Centres of Canada. I'm your host, Jason Cuddy, and on today's episode we welcome back Adam Bajric, who's account manager here at Rush. Adam, welcome back to the podcast.

Adam Bajric:

Thanks for having me.

Jason Cuddy:

So we had John before talking about, you know, heavy haul application and just kind of an overview of what we have product wise. And today I thought we dig into a little bit deeper, kind of application by application which truck, what model, what specs and features? You know, to help kind of people walk through how do I spec it? What's changed? What are some trends we've seen? So you know, I thought we'd start off kind of right off the bat with a tractor, heavy haul tractor. If I'm looking to get into this world, what am I looking at? You know, powertrain will start there.

Adam Bajric:

Yeah. So I mean for the heavy haul side of things, for Navistar, we'd start with the HX chassis. So, be it 620 or 520, if you're looking for a shorter turning wheelbase or a longer turning wheelbase, getting more weight on the axle and getting yourself in compliance with SPF Gotcha, so we'd start off with the HX chassis as the bare bones and then we'd throw in, basically, a Cummins X15 powertrain. Usually we run the performance series on heavy hauls. Guys like it. That you can, you know, play with it. You can bump up horsepower in the long run, you can tune it a little bit more compared to the productivity or the economy style classes.

Adam Bajric:

With that being said, on the performance series, guys usually run in the 565 horse, 1850 foot pounds of torque. You can bump it to a 2050 foot pounds or you can go even up to the 605 if you really want that big boy power. And then we usually pair it with an automatic transmission. The stigmatism, you know, of keeping the manual and the big shifters and whatnot. Yeah, there's still some guys that want them. But, as you know, finding drivers is getting harder and harder and we find that there's a big transition to the automatic stages.

Adam Bajric:

So, with that being said anything, that's usually if you have a gross combination weight of, you know, under 140,000 pounds or up to, I should say I guess, 140,000 pounds, you can run an Allison transmission, six speed. You don't tons of pulling power, anything over that we'd have to switch, usually over to an Eaton Endurant XD. Gotcha, they just released the pro last year or this year I should say. Awesome transmission, lots of features and functionalities. Now a lot of guys like the 18 speeds over the six speeds. They find like they're getting better fuel mileage on them. Whether or not which one's true, it's more driver preference. Both are great. The new Endurant XD actually has a school thing with you remember, with your manuals, even in a car you can kind of roll it out of a snow bank. Yes, well, they got this thing called the rock free switch now, which gives it the same kind of programming and feel to rock yourself out of a whole truck stock.

Jason Cuddy:

Nice, yeah, so I guess. So we've got that, we've got some power train going, we got transmission. What are we pairing that to as far as the axles?

Adam Bajric:

Yeah, so the axle wise I mean Navistar offers Dana and Meritor axles. The most common one is Meritor and the reason behind it is is back in the day there was these axles called Rockwells, and Rockwell actually got perched out by Meritor and they're known for the big round diff cover on it. Guys love them, they're reliable and whatnot. Usually for heavy haul tractors we're going anywhere from a 16 to a 20,000 pound front axle and 46,000 pound rear for suspension. Most guys now are going with air suspension just for a more comfortable ride. You know auto leveling and so forth. We carry the Primax bags. They're an awesome off road bag, really reliable. But you still got some guys that want mechanical and we will join them with mechanical.

Jason Cuddy:

but I've never really seen anyone not like airbags once they go that way, gotcha, and so we've got all that and obviously a lot of concern when you're calling that much weight is, you know, the frame capacity kind of frame ticket? You know what are the different options? I know there's double and single. What do you see?

Adam Bajric:

So Navistar's done a great job now with basically I mean both both frame options are available. There used to be a lot of single frame can't hold it. Our new single frames are capable of 3.5 million RPM, which is overkill, as is. We're running them primarily in the dump truck application, which we'll talk more about later, and the heavy haul family. You'll see guys that are hauling the big, you know oversized, overweight permit loads. They're double framing it.

Jason Cuddy:

Gotcha.

Adam Bajric:

The only downside about the double frames. I mean, yes, they go up to 4.5 million RPM, but you have, you know, the Canadian winter salt, because splitting in the long run, so what you want longevity out of, I mean, you know, if you take care of your stuff, yeah, it's gonna last a long time, but you know you got to take that into consideration.

Jason Cuddy:

Fair. So we've got kind of the underpinnings go in. Obviously, the HX model had a refresh recently. What's kind of new and improved inside for the drivers?

Adam Bajric:

So the HX cab got a full redesign. So we're talking now. We took an LT cab but just beefed it up so you got kind of like the style of car doors where there's no clickety clank anymore. You've got the new diamond elite interior, which is fantastic. It's got, you know, leather stitched seats he didn't cool seat options, swivels If you got a sleeper. You know leather wrapped wheels, a lot of creature comforts that guys are wanting. So you know. And then on the outside we've come. You know twin air cleaners, dual stacks, single stacks. You know you got chrome sunshades, big chrome Texas style bumpers, lots of little creature comforts in that sense. And then also you know you got your standard Alcoa Derb right that everyone loves and a lot of other. You know little key things, keyless entry and so forth.

Jason Cuddy:

Nice. And a neat feature, at least through Navistar, is you know we can put most of that stuff in from the factory but there is also the ability to add more stuff after the factory, before it gets to the dealership.

Adam Bajric:

Yeah, so we got this thing called TSE, which is a truck specialty center, and it's basically literally the building next door to Navistar's the factory line, and you can basically put in special requests. So you know steerable lift axles, fixed lift axles for the heavy haul guys. You know half round fenders, full round fenders. You want a 72 inch aeroslide for the guys that really got to get the weight up front. You know you want to put a hydraulic tank, split tanks, lights, beacons, headache racks, and you can use suppliers, even that are in Ontario. They'll ship down to there. Navistar is a great job of you know hiring them or you know subbing them out and bring them down. So there's a lot of things to kind of free up our shops up here and get the truck over to you faster.

Jason Cuddy:

Nice and so okay. So I've got a tractor built. You know what do I need to put in the back of it? It is dependent on what I'm hauling, like whether it's a float or a live bottom like. What are the nuances and differences that we need to consider there?

Adam Bajric:

So if you're doing into like float tractors, live bottoms and dumps, a lot of those require wetline kits you know for us at Rush we use multiple suppliers, we use gear power over in Mississauga, we use drive tech out in the East End. There's guys up north as well. If you're doing you know, live bottoms, you usually need like a combination wetline kit. If you're doing just you know floats, you need only like a single stage. So there's a lot of options like that. Then you got guys that need more flow, less flow, bigger hydraulic tanks, lesser hydraulic tanks. Some guys need extra switches.

Adam Bajric:

So you know, if you're in the heavy haul world, you got this fourth axle, you want that on a switch. The heavy haul world is a little different than your live bottoms and your end dumps, where they're not exactly spiff compliance because everything is permitted. So you know you're allowed to have switches and cabs on on your float tractors, not for aggregate, not for live bottoms. It's a different world and a lot of people get that kind of confused and say yeah, I can have switches or no, I can't. So there's a lot of little things there that you can play with, but that would be the key features of making it work.

Jason Cuddy:

Nice, okay, so I've got that under control. So say, now I'm looking at the, the dump truck world we'd be talking about briefly maybe let's kind of do something, let's walk through. Okay, I want to. I want to get myself, you know, a new jump tuck and working out what. What am I looking at there from model engine transmission?

Adam Bajric:

Yeah. So the most common for our dump truck line is the HX620. It's a setback axle which guys love because dump trucks are in the city a lot. They want a tighter turning radius. Standard wheelbase on those is a 256 inch wheelbase. You know we're running a 20 or 20 and a half foot dump body. We're running a spiff 23,. You know you're running a 20,000 pounds steer axle on it. We usually pair it with a 425 tire Inside.

Adam Bajric:

Most of the guys want the fully loaded interior. You know, because, again, drivers are in this truck all day, every day. So you know diamond elite interior. You know twin air cleaners, twin stacks, all done up and whatnot. Now, if you're doing, you know the lot of the dump truck guys are into paving and whatnot, so they need to put the pintle hook on the back to pull, you know, a tag along or whatnot, or even a pony pup setup there's. There's a lot of options there that you can play with, but that's kind of like. You know our standard spec In terms of engine wise.

Adam Bajric:

We run a productivity series for that application, usually 500 horse. Some guys really think that you know pulling pups and what they should be at 565, but we've really seen had great success with the 51850 productivity series great fuel mileage, great pulling power, and most guys say they burn the tires off anyways with that kind of horsepower. So it's been a great success. And then transmission, nine times at 10 guys pairing it now with the 4500 series, allison yes, if you're a long hauler like on Sorry, like aggregate hauler pulling a pup, some guys prefer to go the 18 speed, but both will do it because you're at that 140 or under, like we were talking before on the heavy haul side, right Suspension, most guys again, now we're kind of transferring over to the air suspension, to we're running Primax bags.

Adam Bajric:

There is some mechanical guys and I mean, for reasons, if you're, if you're a big like condo excavation guy, a lot of guys like to run the HMX. Suspension tends to give a little bit better grip coming out of the hole and any rough, rough terrain and whatnot Catch. So it helps out a lot too, you know. Then the other thing we can talk about, as well as more, so you know, for running a steerable lift axle or a twin steer, and again it works depending on what the application is Both of them.

Adam Bajric:

There's not one that's better than the other. It both serves different applications, right.

Jason Cuddy:

No, it's fair. Yeah, and then I guess it's your wise. Similar to what was on the day cab, as far as you know, fit feature and options available. Right. Yeah, same same product line and just comes down user preference for the most part.

Adam Bajric:

Yeah.

Jason Cuddy:

Excellent, and then so from a body point of view, obviously that is application specific as well, right, so, I need to know what am I hauling? What were we? Steel versus aluminum? What's? What's the sweet spot of those?

Adam Bajric:

Yeah. So you know if you're an aggregate hauler, you know you're a ton miler, as they call it. You're usually running an aluminum body. You know we sell at rush the Cobra lineup and we have both the air wall and post and panel Summer for looks. Some of you save a little bit of weight. They're both great. They're awesome for getting the volume on your truck. Now if you're hauling, you know rubble, dirt, a mix of everything. Guys tend to go to the steel bodies. We now carry the Bullrock lineup which has been awesome. A lot of guys tend to go in the city. They call it GTA spec. Yep, they run a 46 inch wall at the 48 inch tailgate. It's kind of like the perfect medium for all around for dirt, asphalt, all that kind of fun stuff.

Jason Cuddy:

All right, cool. And I guess another application that maybe we see a bit more of like because it has a bit more versatility but isn't maybe a common one, is, you know, like the roll off hook lift setup and that I guess gives us a mix of opportunities for product line, kind of what do you see? Guys are going to that world.

Adam Bajric:

Yeah, so you're, we're still running like, depending on what you're doing on the, on the big side, we're still running HX's, and then it varies from if you're doing tri axle, tandem or single axles. Right Right now, you know same thing for, like the dump truck, I'm kind of running the same kind of spec in terms of engine power chain and suspension, for you know roll offs. Now, if you're going into tandems and singles, it's just basically. It's now comes down to motor and wheelbase transmission on the MVs and HVs that we offer. Hvs were usually running in tandem spec and then MVs were running in single, single axles configurations. But usually on the HVs you can either run well, now it's trans transitioning, but we had the 826 and the HV 613.

Jason Cuddy:

Right.

Adam Bajric:

And now it's switching over to the S13, which is going to be really exciting to see out on the road shortly. There's also the ability to run the Cummins L9 and the HV 607, which has been a truly well built engine. Lots of guys have them on the road and on the MV you can go from the V6, 7 Cummins or the L9 as well. You can really make some big horsepower on it. In terms of transmissions, on those two units most guys are running a 3000 RDS. It gives you live PTO capabilities, which is awesome. For those that don't know, it's basically you know. It allows you to back up while your trucks and gear to get under that bin, which for most bin guys that are getting into the business, they go. Well, I don't need to roll under your truck. Well, if you're working on somebody's really high end driveway and you know you drag a bin by accident, stuff one up.

Adam Bajric:

you're going to be paying a big price to repair it, so better to have that kind of capability. You know the PTO provision for and being able to roll under the truck Gotcha.

Adam Bajric:

You know, and then, if we're comparing between roll off and hook lift, there's a lot of, you know, question on what should I do? Should I do a hook lift? Should I do a roll off? Because both are in the bin business. Some guys you know you still seeing running around with the common rail system, you know from John and Sons or Capital. And then you have other guys that are transitioning to, like the Atlas Polar. You know, high up hook lifts, right, both have a purpose. If you're in the bin business and you're running anything from basically a five yard up to a 50 yard bin, you can basically make a triaxle, do all those bins together, gotcha. But if you're not in the bin business and or sorry, if you're, yeah. If you're not in the bin business and you're just, you know, looking for a great system, the hook lifts is nice.

Adam Bajric:

The only downside of, I'd say, the hook lift versus the roll off is that you're limited to bend lengths. So your truck's going to be used to only carrying. You know, if you're, we'll use tri-axles for comparison speaking, but comparable, sorry. You're only going to be running like a 20 and a 40 yard bend on a tri-axle setup. You can't go into the five or 10 yards that your standard roll off would be Gotcha. But on the plus side you can parallel park your bends.

Adam Bajric:

You can do a lot of easy pickups and stuff where it's handy. So it really depends on what you're doing. I sell a lot of hook lifts to guys that are in the excavation demolition game because they're allowed hook lifts. Which is funny is this roll off is not allowed into the, into a lot of dump sites for dirt because the way they're shaking the bends out they don't get a proper dump angle. Guys got to come out, open the swing doors and all that With all. As the hook lifts you can go into dump sites, which usually pisses off the roll off guys when they get turned back.

Jason Cuddy:

So yeah, no, fair yeah. So it really comes down to application specific and what you're trying to do and real understanding the market. You're playing in and then fairing out the sweet spot with regards to that. Yeah, so, from product-wide, you mentioned a couple like who, who are the kind of the companies that offer kind of both options that we play with?

Adam Bajric:

In the GTA or Ontario. The biggest guys for roll offs you know as John and Sons they're over in Oakville. You've got Capital as well. That's in that side of town On Trucks is out west. There's a few other smaller guys that are getting into it now. For the most popular hook lifts in the city, you got Atlas Polar, you got Palfinger, you've got the Swap Loader by Drive Products as well, and there's a couple other guys that are also entering the game. But those are kind of like the big, big names that you see rolling around everywhere, gotcha.

Jason Cuddy:

What I find is when you get into application, you know, especially when we're spec'ing the truck, it's nice to pull those guys in right and have them talk with their customer and say, okay, what's your application? Because they, you know they'll see current trends, they'll have a different model line that's come out right, and and then they'll help you spec the truck out too. Right, make sure you've got the right wheel base, make sure the axle ratings are, and they'll do the whole weight analysis for you, right. So make sure that.

Jason Cuddy:

Okay, if you want to run a certain yard bin in this application, you know, maybe we got to move from tridem to a tandem or whatever it is you're trying to do or you know, find that sweet spot, so it is nice you can pull them in and have them do that part of it as well. No, absolutely.

Adam Bajric:

And one of the one of the nice things too. I tell guys all the time when speccing trucks is, they go. How do you know like which one's better? If I'm going to hook lift, you know, is it better for me to go Atlas Polar or Swap Loader or Palfinger, and I go always. Guys, the best thing to do even though there might be one brand that outdoes the other, the best thing is just to find out what supports you the best. If you're out West and Brantford, you're probably better to deal with the FRF Right. If you're out in the East End and you're close to Atlas Polar, they're probably the best guy because they're around the corner from you.

Jason Cuddy:

They break yeah you need support, you need support right, and that's the thing is having a good support network with the vendors that we use and the products we support, plus with Navistar directly as well. So good point. Well, hey, look, thanks for coming in kind of doing a walkthrough of the different application we get to, the heavy spec, certain things to consider and look at and kind of what the trends are that you're seeing. We really appreciate it. Hopefully it gives everyone a general idea of looking at a new truck or a certain application or getting into a different application, things to be asking and to be considering. So I appreciate that. Yeah, thanks, Excellent. Hey, that concludes today's episode. We want to thank Adam for joining us and to catch up on past episodes. Check out Transportation Exchange podcast. ca. Until next time, thanks for listening.